On Lex Fridman’s podcast, Pavel Durov explained why Telegram gifts are “socially relevant NFTs”

On September 30, Lex Fridman shared an interview with 4 and a half hours with Telegram CEO and founder Pavel Durov. Amongst different issues, they’ve touched numerous subjects, together with censorship, authorities strain and freedom of expression. Some elements of their dialogue had been devoted to the crypto house.

Pavel Durov’s Bitcoin funding

In the course of the Lex Fridman interview, Durov mentioned that he’s certain that the Bitcoin worth will attain $ 1,000,000 at a sure second. He remembered that he invested round $ 2,000,000 in Bitcoin in 2013. The prize grumbled the next 12 months, however he stored telling his pals that he wouldn’t promote Bitcoin as a result of he believed on this new factor. Bitcoin is essential for him due to the essential traits:

“I believe that is the best way cash ought to work. No person can confiscate your bitcoin from you. No person can censor you for political causes.”

Pavel famous that it was his Bitcoin funding, not telegram, so he may float, dwell in good areas and fly privately.

Blockchain and telegram

A part of the interview was dedicated to the telegram -based capabilities on Blockchain. In line with Durov, Telegram is the primary app that permits customers to personal their digital id and username instantly through NFTs and good contracts.

Talking of Ton, Durov famous that the Telegram staff was engaged on it in 2018 and 2019. Telegram wanted blockchain “as a result of we consider in blockchain, we predict it is likely one of the applied sciences that makes freedom doable.” Durov mentioned that Bitcoin and Ethereum’s scalability issues reminded him of Telegram’s Customized Layer1 Blockchain that was appropriate for Telegram’s multi-million person base.

Telegram was compelled handy over the TON undertaking to the open neighborhood after the American Securities and Alternate Fee dominated that grams, native tokens of the Ton Blockchain, are results. Now Toncoins assist to finance telegram, as a result of commercials are paid with Ton -Tokens and channels that earn from commercials share half of the revenue with Telegram.

Durov claimed that Telegram items may be outlined as a “re-invented socially related NFT built-in in an ecosystem of billion person, however on the similar time obtainable in chain, transferable, which you’ll be able to possess instantly, additionally based mostly on Ton.”

He went into the best way telegram -gifts are higher NFTs:

“We didn’t like the old-fashioned NFTs. To begin with, they weren’t socially related as a result of, okay, you could have an NFT, the place do you present it? At Telegram there’s a telegram reward subsequent to your title. It belongs to your digital id on Telegram. After which you can also make collections of items and present it in your profile web page.”

In line with Durov, many excessive -profile influencers flowed to Telegram to launch their items after Snoop Dogg had offered $ 12 million to his items in about half-hour.

Durov admitted that he loses cash due to telegram

Fridman outlined that Durov spent thousands and thousands of his personal cash on the undertaking to maintain it in keeping with his views. For instance, Durov was in a position to hold Telegram free from person knowledge based mostly on commercials. Fridman famous that solely by 2024 Telegram turned worthwhile and requested how Telegram earns cash.

Pavel replied that to develop into worthwhile, the Telegram staff needed to be modern. It enabled them to not resort to doubtful enterprise actions during which private knowledge of customers are exploited, one thing that the majority of them of [Telegram’s] rivals try this. “

He added that it’s unhappy for him to make use of knowledge from person actions, metadata and different sorts of private data for commercial -targeting turned synonymous with the web trade.

Whereas Telegram turned worthwhile, Durov admitted that he misplaced extra money that invested in Telegram than he returned. In some unspecified time in the future Telegram selected to cope with a subscription mannequin. Durov determined to maintain all current capabilities untouched whereas including some extras for paid subscribers, akin to enterprise channels or superior customers.

After the launch in 2022, 15 million telegram customers obtained paid subscriptions. In 2025 Durov mentioned that the corporate will obtain round $ 500 million from premium subscriptions.

One other supply of revenue is the 5% committee that’s charged from exterior builders who launch mini apps and bots in Telegram. Durov, nevertheless, means that it doesn’t yield a lot cash; It’s quite extra helpful as a technique to entice extra customers.

Pavel Durov as a lawyer for freedom of expression

Fridman launched Durov as a hunter for privateness and freedom of communication and continued his mission, regardless of immense strain from totally different governments. Within the years 2010, Durov needed to battle with the Russian authorities. In 2024 he was arrested in Paris. Since then he has had tensions with the French authorities.

Durov informed Fridman that the French authorities encourage him to dam help teams for presidential candidates in Moldova and Romania. In line with Durov, he denied interference whereas blocking some teams that violated the principles of the platform. Durov was informed that his actions may affect the continual investigation towards him in France. That is what he informed Fridman:

“After Telegram forbade the few channels that had been opposite to our guidelines in Moldava, they spoke with my decide, the investigating decide on this investigation that began towards me, and the decide informed them that they may take into consideration me. I discovered that very complicated and, in a way, as a result of these two didn’t make sufficient vacancies?”

Whereas Fridman and lots of others Durov name a lawyer of freedom of expression preventing towards the federal government’s oppression, some paint him in several colours. For instance, the Russian non -governmental elections monitoring Teams declare that Telegram is obstructing their bots. In June 2025, the essential story analysis pointed With the tires of messengers with FSB.